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	<title>Comments on: The Crab and the Bear: On Alexander Dugin</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/</link>
	<description>Not Your Grandfather&#039;s Conservatism</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 03 Sep 2015 20:20:23 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Ted Colt</title>
		<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/#comment-15618</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ted Colt]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Jul 2015 16:04:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.socialmatter.net/?p=1651#comment-15618</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[An authoritarian can be identified by advocating for limits upon what can be published.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An authoritarian can be identified by advocating for limits upon what can be published.</p>
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		<title>By: GCM</title>
		<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/#comment-11800</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[GCM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2015 03:02:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.socialmatter.net/?p=1651#comment-11800</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[According to Dugin, the whole Internet should be banned, &quot;I think that Internet as such, as a phenomenon is worth prohibiting because it gives nobody anything good.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>According to Dugin, the whole Internet should be banned, &#8220;I think that Internet as such, as a phenomenon is worth prohibiting because it gives nobody anything good.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Citadel</title>
		<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/#comment-11482</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mark Citadel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Mar 2015 03:39:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.socialmatter.net/?p=1651#comment-11482</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I do not think such differences are irreconcilable. You desire the downfall of the current world order as much as we do. Insomuch as such a post-Atlanticist world will have vast tracts of land that require states and societies, this is where the Reactionary would seek to lay down roots. No Reactionary wishes any war with another society of Traditional character, such as the one that you describe to be built in Russia. Our enemies are the same. Our goals, while perhaps ideologically nonidentical and geographically disparate, may serve each others&#039; purposes.

Any harm you can cause the political order of the West is much obliged on our part, and we certainly have no love for the Ukrainian power grab by NATO. I think most Reactionaries would say, full steam ahead to Kiev if you wish.

I will however critique 4PT as veering dangerously close to the very mistakes made by Mussolini&#039;s Fascists, that is submerging oneself in an anti-Modernist, Reactionary mindset, but rather than going all the way in, creating a kind of makeshift ideology picking out the bits you like from the World of Tradition. If the Vedic Tradition proves correct, the Golden Age will not be some half-pure, Frankenstein&#039;s monster of past ideals, but in fact the full rebirth of our ancestors&#039; ordered world. Some of the in-depth constructive criticisms leveled at 4PT by Neoreaction are valid and Dugin would do well to study them.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do not think such differences are irreconcilable. You desire the downfall of the current world order as much as we do. Insomuch as such a post-Atlanticist world will have vast tracts of land that require states and societies, this is where the Reactionary would seek to lay down roots. No Reactionary wishes any war with another society of Traditional character, such as the one that you describe to be built in Russia. Our enemies are the same. Our goals, while perhaps ideologically nonidentical and geographically disparate, may serve each others&#8217; purposes.</p>
<p>Any harm you can cause the political order of the West is much obliged on our part, and we certainly have no love for the Ukrainian power grab by NATO. I think most Reactionaries would say, full steam ahead to Kiev if you wish.</p>
<p>I will however critique 4PT as veering dangerously close to the very mistakes made by Mussolini&#8217;s Fascists, that is submerging oneself in an anti-Modernist, Reactionary mindset, but rather than going all the way in, creating a kind of makeshift ideology picking out the bits you like from the World of Tradition. If the Vedic Tradition proves correct, the Golden Age will not be some half-pure, Frankenstein&#8217;s monster of past ideals, but in fact the full rebirth of our ancestors&#8217; ordered world. Some of the in-depth constructive criticisms leveled at 4PT by Neoreaction are valid and Dugin would do well to study them.</p>
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		<title>By: Ash Milton</title>
		<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/#comment-11446</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ash Milton]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Mar 2015 07:33:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.socialmatter.net/?p=1651#comment-11446</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m rather interested in seeing how you plan on keeping the nationalists and communists from turning their arms on each other the moment there&#039;s a lull in the great crusade against the West. The enemy of your enemy is not your philosophical brother in arms, and Lenin&#039;s enemies learned that very quickly.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m rather interested in seeing how you plan on keeping the nationalists and communists from turning their arms on each other the moment there&#8217;s a lull in the great crusade against the West. The enemy of your enemy is not your philosophical brother in arms, and Lenin&#8217;s enemies learned that very quickly.</p>
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		<title>By: Hadley Bennett</title>
		<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/#comment-11441</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Hadley Bennett]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Mar 2015 03:54:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.socialmatter.net/?p=1651#comment-11441</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Question: Are you ethnically Russian, based in Russia, or both?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Question: Are you ethnically Russian, based in Russia, or both?</p>
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		<title>By: Akira</title>
		<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/#comment-11439</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Akira]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Mar 2015 03:42:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.socialmatter.net/?p=1651#comment-11439</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[There are very real conflicts between 4PT and NRx. Whatever alliance may be possible, we have very serious differences that are not negotiable. My point here is not to argue them but rather to make them clear:

1-The total and intransigent opposition to racism is fundamental to 4PT. We recognize the white liberal racism of the west as the source of all the worst aspects of modernity. We are on the side of its victims. All races are welcomed into our ranks. 

(Everyone who thinks Dugin is a racist white nationalist is a damned illiterate.)

2-4PT is pro-Jewish and pro-Islamic. We oppose racist Zionism and the Wahabist abomination, but not Judaism or Islam. We have supporters in both Tel Aviv and Teheran. Some of the founders and most important cadre of the Eurasianist movement are Rabbis and Muftis. All other religions are equally welcomed.

3-4PT recognizes race as a social construction. We are heavily influenced by the structural and cultural anthropology of the new left as well as the sociological analysis of Marxism. 

4-4PT recognizes modern nationalism as a social construction. We prefer a healthy traditionalism built around the sacred and the ethnos to the diseased modernist conception of the nation.

5-4PT regards the market based society as a complete abomination. We are even more anti-capitalist than Marxists and even more anti-globalist than Anarchists. We also reject socialism and every other ideology that orders society around economics as such.

6-4PT is inspired by the madmen and heretics of both the right and the left. We mix Evola, Nietzsche, Heidegger, Junger, and Schmitt, with Debord, Gramsci, Foucault, Baudrillard, Deleuze, Derrida, and Sorel (just to begin with). When Dugin talks of a sacred front beyond right and left *he actually means it*. This is not Troy Southgate bullshit. We have a Communist international and a Makhnovist brigade of Ukrainian Anarchists fighting next to our glorious Eurasianist cadre to liberate Ukraine from the nazi-neoliberal Junta.

7-4PT is a revolutionary theory for a revolutionary movement. Eurasianism is the revolutionary movement. The global revolutionary alliance is the coalition of this movement. The revolutionary conflict is a global geopolitical war between the American neoliberal empire and the rest of the world. (That means you, American.) We are on the side of everyone else. 

8-4PT is hostile to the entire civilization of western liberalism, not merely its worst aspects or nastiest parts. We believe your civilization is imploding and we have always intended to help it along. Now that your deranged elites are making war with Russia, the gloves are really going to come off. (You are going to pay for Victoria Nuland and her cookies.)

9-Push has come to shove with the fascist and racist factions of the European new right in Ukraine. The era of fellow traveling with them is over. We will never forget the hideous crimes carried out by these degenerate traitors, or that they so cravenly allied themselves with a US state department coup intended to feed the people of Ukraine to the vultures of neoliberalism. Neo-nazis have always been illiterate snitches, and now they have shown their true colors as allies of Barack Obama and liberalism.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are very real conflicts between 4PT and NRx. Whatever alliance may be possible, we have very serious differences that are not negotiable. My point here is not to argue them but rather to make them clear:</p>
<p>1-The total and intransigent opposition to racism is fundamental to 4PT. We recognize the white liberal racism of the west as the source of all the worst aspects of modernity. We are on the side of its victims. All races are welcomed into our ranks. </p>
<p>(Everyone who thinks Dugin is a racist white nationalist is a damned illiterate.)</p>
<p>2-4PT is pro-Jewish and pro-Islamic. We oppose racist Zionism and the Wahabist abomination, but not Judaism or Islam. We have supporters in both Tel Aviv and Teheran. Some of the founders and most important cadre of the Eurasianist movement are Rabbis and Muftis. All other religions are equally welcomed.</p>
<p>3-4PT recognizes race as a social construction. We are heavily influenced by the structural and cultural anthropology of the new left as well as the sociological analysis of Marxism. </p>
<p>4-4PT recognizes modern nationalism as a social construction. We prefer a healthy traditionalism built around the sacred and the ethnos to the diseased modernist conception of the nation.</p>
<p>5-4PT regards the market based society as a complete abomination. We are even more anti-capitalist than Marxists and even more anti-globalist than Anarchists. We also reject socialism and every other ideology that orders society around economics as such.</p>
<p>6-4PT is inspired by the madmen and heretics of both the right and the left. We mix Evola, Nietzsche, Heidegger, Junger, and Schmitt, with Debord, Gramsci, Foucault, Baudrillard, Deleuze, Derrida, and Sorel (just to begin with). When Dugin talks of a sacred front beyond right and left *he actually means it*. This is not Troy Southgate bullshit. We have a Communist international and a Makhnovist brigade of Ukrainian Anarchists fighting next to our glorious Eurasianist cadre to liberate Ukraine from the nazi-neoliberal Junta.</p>
<p>7-4PT is a revolutionary theory for a revolutionary movement. Eurasianism is the revolutionary movement. The global revolutionary alliance is the coalition of this movement. The revolutionary conflict is a global geopolitical war between the American neoliberal empire and the rest of the world. (That means you, American.) We are on the side of everyone else. </p>
<p>8-4PT is hostile to the entire civilization of western liberalism, not merely its worst aspects or nastiest parts. We believe your civilization is imploding and we have always intended to help it along. Now that your deranged elites are making war with Russia, the gloves are really going to come off. (You are going to pay for Victoria Nuland and her cookies.)</p>
<p>9-Push has come to shove with the fascist and racist factions of the European new right in Ukraine. The era of fellow traveling with them is over. We will never forget the hideous crimes carried out by these degenerate traitors, or that they so cravenly allied themselves with a US state department coup intended to feed the people of Ukraine to the vultures of neoliberalism. Neo-nazis have always been illiterate snitches, and now they have shown their true colors as allies of Barack Obama and liberalism.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Citadel</title>
		<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/#comment-11399</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mark Citadel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Mar 2015 02:21:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.socialmatter.net/?p=1651#comment-11399</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[One thing to bear in mind when discussing Dugin, who definitely falls under the larger umbrella of Reaction (though as a rather bizarre and specifically Russian brand) is that as well as being an intellectual, he is involved in actual policy and this has a MASSIVE impact on what he says and how he behaves as compared to your typical Reactosphere blogger. When Dugin says something that seems to be hypocritical, or in contention with something he has written, he is often doing so for political expediency. Thus, the Russian regime will call the Ukrainian government &#039;far right fascists&#039; when the Kremlin is actively involved in aiding groups that fit that description far better around Europe. Dugin knows the game, and he plays it. More power to him. That&#039;s how you win. You can think about fair play after the enemy is destroyed.

I do often think his influence is overstated. His star has faded within the Kremlin in recent years. I don&#039;t even think he holds his University professorship anymore after being dismissed. He does still have the ear of a key lawmaker though.

Dugin&#039;s concept of Eurasianism is a little too supernational to be pulled off in my opinion, but he has the right idea. What&#039;s more, he&#039;s Orthodox, so he and I have a common bond so to speak.

Russia is not the &#039;great white hope&#039;... yet. There is a lot that needs to happen before that can be said, but it is a country whose political elite and surprisingly popular opinion are on a positive trajectory, and trajectories make all the difference in the world. Promotion of Reactionary ideals in the Slavic world is the most promising prospect if we want a tangible base of operation and support, perhaps in the future even funding will stem from Russia for subversive Reactionary projects in the west and elsewhere.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One thing to bear in mind when discussing Dugin, who definitely falls under the larger umbrella of Reaction (though as a rather bizarre and specifically Russian brand) is that as well as being an intellectual, he is involved in actual policy and this has a MASSIVE impact on what he says and how he behaves as compared to your typical Reactosphere blogger. When Dugin says something that seems to be hypocritical, or in contention with something he has written, he is often doing so for political expediency. Thus, the Russian regime will call the Ukrainian government &#8216;far right fascists&#8217; when the Kremlin is actively involved in aiding groups that fit that description far better around Europe. Dugin knows the game, and he plays it. More power to him. That&#8217;s how you win. You can think about fair play after the enemy is destroyed.</p>
<p>I do often think his influence is overstated. His star has faded within the Kremlin in recent years. I don&#8217;t even think he holds his University professorship anymore after being dismissed. He does still have the ear of a key lawmaker though.</p>
<p>Dugin&#8217;s concept of Eurasianism is a little too supernational to be pulled off in my opinion, but he has the right idea. What&#8217;s more, he&#8217;s Orthodox, so he and I have a common bond so to speak.</p>
<p>Russia is not the &#8216;great white hope&#8217;&#8230; yet. There is a lot that needs to happen before that can be said, but it is a country whose political elite and surprisingly popular opinion are on a positive trajectory, and trajectories make all the difference in the world. Promotion of Reactionary ideals in the Slavic world is the most promising prospect if we want a tangible base of operation and support, perhaps in the future even funding will stem from Russia for subversive Reactionary projects in the west and elsewhere.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Citadel</title>
		<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/#comment-11398</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mark Citadel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Mar 2015 02:12:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.socialmatter.net/?p=1651#comment-11398</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The distinction between Traditionalist and Reactionary is really only one of intent and context.

Those living before the dawn of the Kali Yuga, so &#039;pre-Enlightenment&#039; may be considered Traditionalists, as their Tradition was passive in nature. There was no other competing political ideology. However, those who seek the restoration of the World of Tradition in the post-Enlightenment era can be deemed Reactionary, as we do have political ideologies opposing us and thus are forced intro conflict with them.

A Reactionaries goal is really to become a Traditionalist... to remove all competing ideologies to Tradition, the main one now being liberal democracy.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The distinction between Traditionalist and Reactionary is really only one of intent and context.</p>
<p>Those living before the dawn of the Kali Yuga, so &#8216;pre-Enlightenment&#8217; may be considered Traditionalists, as their Tradition was passive in nature. There was no other competing political ideology. However, those who seek the restoration of the World of Tradition in the post-Enlightenment era can be deemed Reactionary, as we do have political ideologies opposing us and thus are forced intro conflict with them.</p>
<p>A Reactionaries goal is really to become a Traditionalist&#8230; to remove all competing ideologies to Tradition, the main one now being liberal democracy.</p>
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		<title>By: Orthodox Laissezfairist</title>
		<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/#comment-11215</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Orthodox Laissezfairist]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Feb 2015 14:30:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.socialmatter.net/?p=1651#comment-11215</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s interesting that he considers Communism part of Russian identity, because surviving Russian royalists, the White émigrés, claimed that Communists couldn&#039;t be Russian. It is similar to how Taiwanese consider themselves to be the true Chinese, and don&#039;t consider the PRC Chinks Chinese at all. Dump Alexander Dugin; if you want real Russian Conservatism read Ivan Ilyin.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s interesting that he considers Communism part of Russian identity, because surviving Russian royalists, the White émigrés, claimed that Communists couldn&#8217;t be Russian. It is similar to how Taiwanese consider themselves to be the true Chinese, and don&#8217;t consider the PRC Chinks Chinese at all. Dump Alexander Dugin; if you want real Russian Conservatism read Ivan Ilyin.</p>
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		<title>By: Reed Perry</title>
		<link>http://www.socialmatter.net/2015/02/27/crab-bear-dugin/#comment-11204</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Reed Perry]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Feb 2015 09:27:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.socialmatter.net/?p=1651#comment-11204</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[http://imgur.com/4I6NOLq]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://imgur.com/4I6NOLq" rel="nofollow">http://imgur.com/4I6NOLq</a></p>
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